¿Podría haber existido el Bitcoin antes del 2009?

[McNulty]

Si no fuera por la criptografía, estarías ahora escribiendo cartas al director de algún periódico con la olivetti de tu padre, en lugar de haciendo tus deposiciones en la hinternec.

Me encanta provocaros.:XX:

Estáis vendiendo la piel del oso antes de cazarlo. Los bitcoineros os estáis convirtiendo en una especie de secta cyberpunk.

 

[tastas]

Me encanta provocaros.:XX:

Estáis vendiendo la piel del oso antes de cazarlo. Los bitcoineros os estáis convirtiendo en una especie de secta cyberpunk.

Es al revés. La secta cyberpunk se está extendiendo incluso sobre aquéllos que no quieren saber nada de sectas cyberpunk.
Seguro que algún petulante también se reía de la secta pitagórica y mira por dónde, las ideas de ahí surgidas prevalecen.

 

[McNulty]

Es al revés. La secta cyberpunk se está extendiendo incluso sobre aquéllos que no quieren saber nada de sectas cyberpunk.
Seguro que algún petulante también se reía de la secta pitagórica y mira por dónde, las ideas de ahí surgidas prevalecen.

Si, igualitos que los pitagoricos sois, que descubrieron los números irracionales ! Teoremas etc,,,XX::XX:

Lo,dicho, estáis en una burbuja virtual de auto complacencia total. Estáis en fase tecnoreligiosa.

 

[ninfireblade]

Si, igualitos que los pitagoricos sois, que descubrieron los números irracionales ! Teoremas etc,,,XX::XX:

Lo,dicho, estáis en una burbuja virtual de auto complacencia total. Estáis en fase tecnoreligiosa.

Mientras siga habiendo gente como tu, soltando bilis por los foros, quiere decir que vamos por buen camino. El día que nos quedemos solos entonces me empezaré a preocupar.

 

[McNulty]

Vuestro rollo secta de iluminados terminará, cuando un Estado grande y con poder, aplique la tecnología blockchain y la haga masiva y confiable al consumidor medio.

 

[KA3UMUPOBUU]

pensad una cosa, la gran mayoria de los bitcoins que se minaron en los primeros años, ante de los ASIC, nunca se han vendido.

que puede impulsar a un informatico, un currante al fin y al cabo, a conservar cientos o miles de bitcoins sin vender ni uno?

como aguantaron sin vender en la burbuja de los 1000 dolares, o en la de los 20.000?

con vender la mitad muchos serian ricos para toda su vida pero ahi estan sus btc, guardaditos, esperando a no se sabe que, exponiendose a extraviarlos, a la prohibicion, a la competencia de otras cryptos, o al hundimiento definitivo del mercado.

evidentemente, la mayoria de los early adopters no son frikis ni cyberpunks, son gente que se permite despreciar una fortuna y que saben cosas que el resto ignoramos.

 

[ninfireblade]

pensad una cosa, la gran mayoria de los bitcoins que se minaron en los primeros años, ante de los ASIC, nunca se han vendido.

Bueno en realidad esto no es exactamente así. Lei hace poco unos analisis muy exhaustivos sobre esto y las conclusiones que se sacaban asi a grandes rasgos, es que cuando se produjeron grandes bull runs como la subida de los $2 a los $30 o cuando la primera subida a los $1000 se produjeron muchos movimientos de esos viejos bitcoins, seguramente hacia los exchanges para venderlos.

Tambien hay una parte relativamente alta que siguen sin moverse y se supone que son bitcoins que estan perdidos. Piensa que en el 2009-2010 era relativamente facil minar varios miles de bitcoins con un simple ordenador de sobremesa. Esos bitcoins practicamente no tenian ningun valor y cuando eso pasa es facil que la gente termine formateando el ordenador o borrando el wallet, etc, perdiendo esos bitcoins para siempre.

Si luego encuentro esos articulos los postearé por aquí.

 

[kerevienteya]

Antes de bitcoin hubo intentos de hacer criptos, con las evidentes diferencias a lo que hay ahora, pero sin duda, sirvieron de precursores a btc. Lo curioso es porque con btc no fueron a muerte, como con algunas de las anteriores...
Buen articulo:
Were There Cryptocurrencies Before Bitcoin?



In recent years, the investment and technology worlds have become saturated with cryptocurrencies, bockchain apps, and related ventures and projects. In spite of the tidal wave of new digital currencies that has transformed the market, however, there has remained a single digital currency that has held the attention of the public more than any other: bitcoin (BTC). Many investors consider bitcoin to be the original cryptocurrency. Founded in 2009 by a programmer (or, possibly, a group of programmers) under the pseudonym Satoshi Nakamoto, bitcoin ushered in a new age of blockchain technology and decentralized digital currencies. Satoshi's whitepaper outlining bitcoin also describes the concept of blockchain technology for the first time, saying that "the network timestamps transactions by hashing them into an ongoing chain of hash-based proof-of-work, forming a record that cannot be changed without redoing the proof-of-work." While there is no doubt that bitcoin has had a revolutionary impact on the cryptocurrency space (as of this writing, it has spawned dozens of forks and imitators, and it remains the number one digital currency in the world by market cap and several other metrics), is it really the first cryptocurrency?
Early Attempts in the Netherlands

According to a report in Bitcoin Magazine, one of the earliest attempts at creating a cryptocurrency actually predates bitcoin's creation by about 20 years. Petrol stations in the Netherlands were suffering from nighttime thefts. Rather than post guards and risk their safety, a group of developers attempted to link money to newly-designed smartcards. Truck drivers who needed to access the stations would carry these cards instead of cash, and the stations would not have paper money lying around. This may have been the earliest example of electronic cash, which has links to digital currencies as we know them today.
Blinded Cash

Around the same time, or perhaps even earlier, American cryptographer David Chaum experimented with a different form of electronic cash. He conceptualized a token currency which could be transferred between individuals both safely and privately; again, the similarities to modern day cryptocurrencies are striking. Chaum developed a so-called "blinding formula" to be used to encrypt information passed between individuals. "Blinded cash" could thus be safely transferred between individuals, bearing a signature of authenticity and the ability to be modified without traceability. Chaum founded DigiCash to put his concept into practice several years later. Although DigiCash went bankrupt in 1998, the concepts the company put forward as well as some of its formulas and encryption tools played an important role in the development of later digital currencies.
Web-Based Money

In the 1990s, a number of startups made efforts at furthering the goals of DigiCash. Of these, perhaps the company with the greatest lasting impact on the broader financial world was PayPal (PYPL). PayPal revolutionized person-to-person payments online. It allowed individuals to quickly and securely transfer money via web browser. By connecting itself to the eBay community, PayPal secured a dedicated userbase which allowed it to grow and thrive. It remains a major payments service today. PayPal also inspired its imitators, including companies which attempted to provide a means for trading gold via web browser. One of the more successful of these operations was called e-gold, which offered individuals online credit in exchange for physical gold and other precious metals. This company ran into issues with various types of scams, however, and was eventually shut down by the federal government in 2005.
B-Money

In 1998, developer Wei Dai proposed an "anonymous, distributed electronic cash system" called B-money. Dai suggested two different protocols, including one which required a broadcast channel that was both synchronous and unjammable. Ultimately, B-money was never successful, and indeed, it was quite different from bitcoin in many ways. Nonetheless, it was also an attempt at an anonymous, private, and secure electronic cash system. In the B-money system, digital pseudonyms would be used in order to transfer currency through a decentralized network. The system even included a means for contract enforcement in-network as well, without the use of a third party. Although Wei Dai proposed a whitepaper for B-money, it was ultimately unable to garner enough attention for a successful launch. Still, Satoshi referenced elements of B-money in his bitcoin whitepaper roughly a decade later, so the impact of B-money on the current digital currency craze is undeniable.
Bit Gold

Not to be confused with the contemporary gold-based exchange of a similar name, Bit Gold was another electronic currency system which dates back to the same period as B-money. Proposed by Nick Szabo, Bit Gold came with its own proof-of-work system that in some ways is mirrored by today's bitcoin mining process. Through this procedure, solutions were compiled cryptographically and then published for the public in much the same way a modern blockchain would function.

Perhaps the most revolutionary aspect of the Bit Gold concept, however, had to do with its movement away from centralized status. Bit Gold aimed to avoid reliance on centralized currency distributors and authorities. Szabo's aim was for Bit Gold to reflect the properties of real gold, thereby enabling users to eliminate the middleman entirely. Bit Gold, like B-money, was ultimately unsuccessful. However, it too provided inspiration for a large group of digital currencies which would enter the market a decade or more after its introduction.
Hashcash

Developed in the mid-1990s, Hashcash was one of the most successful pre-bitcoin digital currencies, according to The Merkle. Hashcash was designed for a number of purposes, including minimizing email spam and preventing DDoS attacks, Hashcash opened up a wide array of possibilities which would only be realized nearly two decades later. Hashcash used a proof-of-work algorithm to aid the generation and distribution of new coins, much like many contemporary cryptocurrencies. Indeed, Hashcash also ran into many of the same problems as today's cryptocurrencies today; in 1997, facing an increased processing power need, Hashcash eventually became less and less effective. In spite of the fact that it eventually fizzled out, Hashcash saw a large degree of interest in its heyday. Many of the elements of the Hashcash system worked their way into bitcoin's development as well.

When bitcoin was developed in 2009, it launched a new generation of digital currencies. Bitcoin differs from many of is predecessors in its decentralized status and its development of blockchain technology. However, it's difficult to imagine the creation of bitcoin, let alone the hundreds of other digital currencies which have since launched, without the earlier attempts at cryptocurrencies and electronic cash in the decades before bitcoin was launched.

Investing in cryptocurrencies and Initial Coin Offerings ("ICOs") is highly risky and speculative, and this article is not a recommendation by Investopedia or the writer to invest in cryptocurrencies or ICOs. Since each individual's situation is unique, a qualified professional should always be consulted before making any financial decisions. Investopedia makes no representations or warranties as to the accuracy or timeliness of the information contained herein. As of the date this article was written, the author owns bitcoin and ripple.

 

[KA3UMUPOBUU]

Bueno en realidad esto no es exactamente así. Lei hace poco unos analisis muy exhaustivos sobre esto y las conclusiones que se sacaban asi a grandes rasgos, es que cuando se produjeron grandes bull runs como la subida de los $2 a los $30 o cuando la primera subida a los $1000 se produjeron muchos movimientos de esos viejos bitcoins, seguramente hacia los exchanges para venderlos.

Tambien hay una parte relativamente alta que siguen sin moverse y se supone que son bitcoins que estan perdidos. Piensa que en el 2009-2010 era relativamente facil minar varios miles de bitcoins con un simple ordenador de sobremesa. Esos bitcoins practicamente no tenian ningun valor y cuando eso pasa es facil que la gente termine formateando el ordenador o borrando el wallet, etc, perdiendo esos bitcoins para siempre.

Si luego encuentro esos articulos los postearé por aquí.

pero hay un articulo de 2015 con una tabla excel con las direcciones durmientes, mayores de 25 btc, unos 3.500.000 BTC, ademas que esten perdidos, como tu bien dices, es un suponer.

Dormant Bitcoin Addresses with a balance of 25btc or more - Hojas de cálculo de Google

 

[ninfireblade]

pero hay un articulo de 2015 con una tabla excel con las direcciones durmientes, mayores de 25 btc, unos 3.500.000 BTC, ademas que esten perdidos, como tu bien dices, es un suponer.

Dormant Bitcoin Addresses with a balance of 25btc or more - Hojas de cálculo de Google

Aquí tienes los artículos a los que me refería:


Bitcoin Data Science (Pt. 1): HODL Waves

Bitcoin Data Science (Pt. 2): The Geology of Lost Coins

Bitcoin Data Science (Pt. 3): Dust & Thermodynamics

 

[KA3UMUPOBUU]

Aquí tienes los artículos a los que me refería:


Bitcoin Data Science (Pt. 1): HODL Waves

Bitcoin Data Science (Pt. 2): The Geology of Lost Coins

Bitcoin Data Science (Pt. 3): Dust & Thermodynamics

muy interesantes los graficos,

pero ahi se ve por ejemplo en diciembre del año pasado habia como 3 millones de btc que no habian cambiado de manos en los ultimos 5 años, de cuando btc valia solo 13$ , aparte añadele el 25% de movimientos para cobrar los bch y mudrse a direccioens sewit

peor es verdad, se han movido mas de lo que yo creia

 

[Areding]

Es posible que pueda existir en teoría pero no en técnica porque los equipos no le habrían permitido desarrollarse y el problema sería en un pequeño número de vendedores porque pocos tendrían acceso al internet.

 

[zyro]

. Lo curioso es porque con btc no fueron a muerte, como con algunas de las anteriores...

interesante

 

[easyridergs]

El Chino lo hizo nacer, El Chino lo hizo crecer, El Chino lo matará.

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